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Stitching Fool
Chatty Knitter

196 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  4:35:52 PM  Show Profile Send Stitching Fool a Private Message
Hi,

I subscribe to knitting daily and have been absolutely amazed at the RUDENESS that some knitters express (in the "share your comments" section) anytime a crochet topic is the topic of the day.

I was wondering if anyone else has read these comments--the entitlement attitude is mind boggling !! Do these people "get" that this is a free website created, in part I would think, as a subtle advertising for Interweave-published magazines and books.

Have a Nice Day,
Marie

bluestocking5
Chatty Knitter

180 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  4:44:28 PM  Show Profile Send bluestocking5 a Private Message
Woah! Seeing this post made me go back and read the comments. How bizarre! Where is all this hostility coming from?

My knitting:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bluestocking5/
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Mocha
Permanent Resident

Singapore
2903 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  7:19:45 PM  Show Profile Send Mocha a Private Message
Marie, you're out of context. The readers are expressing their view on crochet inside a knitting editorial. What's wrong with that?

If the same comment is expressed at any Crochet forum/media, that is beyond boundary. Ah, that is rudeness, and you can complain about that.

Besides, you can't police other people's thoughts, feelings & views.
It is the same as you posting this comment on other Knitters on this forum.

Just take everything with a pinch of salt. You know that there is the other side of the coins where knitters & crocheters coexist peacefully.

And, yes, it'd be quite hard to miss that the newsletter promotes IK magazines, books, patterns, etc. What else do you expect from the publisher? Lion Brand content?

If you're not happy, just unsubscribe to it. If you don't like the email, then delete it.
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fiberlicious
Permanent Resident

1637 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  8:22:54 PM  Show Profile Send fiberlicious a Private Message
Well, I'm just a dumbass. I can't even figure out how to read the comments.
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bluestocking5
Chatty Knitter

180 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  8:42:39 PM  Show Profile Send bluestocking5 a Private Message
Mocha - you are right, of course, everyone has the right to freely express their opinion. But I was taken aback by the vehemence of some of the comments which seem out of place in a (much better than anticipated) free newsletter designed to promote Interweave Knits. If they had a guest editorial from someone interested in fly fishing (I pulled that one out of thin air, sorry those who love fly fishing and knitting that I have just offended) maybe I could understand it... but crochet?! It just seems really odd (to me). And begs the question why?

My knitting:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bluestocking5/
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mokey
Permanent Resident

15375 Posts

Posted - 11/20/2007 :  9:21:27 PM  Show Profile Send mokey a Private Message
I can't blame people for being upset. It is "Knitting Daily" not "Knitting Daily with Crochet."

Brought to you by the tongue in cheek-y monkey
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Bethany
Permanent Resident

USA
1546 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  12:46:59 AM  Show Profile Send Bethany a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by mokey

I can't blame people for being upset. It is "Knitting Daily" not "Knitting Daily with Crochet."



Of course those people got upset. They were actually forced to NOT READ something that didn't interest them FOR ONE DAY. What a hardship! Next thing you know, Knitting Daily might start posting columns about lace knitting or socks knowing there are some knitters who don't like lace knitting or socks, and then THOSE knitters might have to skip a column, too. Where will it end?

And how dare Interweave mention crochet in their Knitting Daily newsletter. It's not as if they have a crochet magazine to advertise or anything!

Seriously, I've never understood the anti-crochet attitude so many knitters seem to have. Maybe it's just because I learned crochet first, but I still find it amazing that there are so many knitters that can't crochet. It's such a useful skill for people interested in the fiber arts to have.
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Atavistic
Permanent Resident

6604 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  02:34:07 AM  Show Profile  Visit Atavistic's Homepage Send Atavistic a Private Message
quote:

Seriously, I've never understood the anti-crochet attitude so many knitters seem to have. Maybe it's just because I learned crochet first, but I still find it amazing that there are so many knitters that can't crochet. It's such a useful skill for people interested in the fiber arts to have.



Yeah, I don't get it either. And I still finish a lot of my shells in crochet--it's much neater than knitting a lot of the time.

Amanda Takes Off... and Amanda Knits

Hand and foot when harmonized forms martialism/but Military and literary when harmonized is art and this brings/philosophy. (Lee, Chang Hoo)
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suzannevh
Gabber Extraordinaire

565 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  06:10:36 AM  Show Profile Send suzannevh a Private Message
I don't get it either. There are many fiber related things I don't do - spinning, hand dying yarn, needle felting - that aren't knitting but are frequently mentioned in Knitting magazines and communities. It's my choice to read it or not or to buy the magazine or not based on my interest in the overall content. I certainly wouldn't feel entitled to complain to a free newsletter/magazine for diverting some of their content away from strictly knitting.

Now, If I had a paid subscription to Interweave Knits and the patterns and content starting shifting towards a lot of crochet I would feel I had a right to complain and might decide not to renew. But even then my complaint should be that I paid for knitting not crochet - and not that crochet is ugly or inferior.

Check out my project pics

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queenmaxine
Gabber Extraordinaire

USA
472 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  06:21:48 AM  Show Profile  Visit queenmaxine's Homepage Send queenmaxine a Private Message
I'm with you fiberlicious! I didn't even know there were comments to see. I have yet to figure that out. I also crochet, and when I saw this post I didn't connect right away that it was in the crochet section. I thought it was going to be a post complaining about the Knitting Daily that isn't knitting content daily but knitting daily and sometimes nothing more than an Interweave Press ad or beg with zero knitting content. I am not ready to unsub yet, but I am hugely disappointed.

My blog is not strictly knitting, but there are occasional WIP updates and frustration or bragging rants as I am a new knitter.

www.nolanoni.blogspot.com
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Katheroni
Permanent Resident

USA
1407 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  09:31:42 AM  Show Profile Send Katheroni a Private Message
Yeah, I think it's weird, too. I could understand being upset if you're a non-crocheter and paid to subscribe to a knitting magazine if there were lots of crochet patterns. But for a free e-mailed newsletter/blog? Even if you do despise crochet, what's the big deal? Most of the comments weren't out of line. There's nothing wrong with expressing opinion. But there were a few skirting insults.

I'm with Amanda about combining the two. Crochet, although it stands on its own, can be very successfully combined with knitting. Would knitters be up in arms if Knitting Daily wanted to explore various bind-offs? Why be opposed to learning a new skill? You don't have to want to actually do the skill, but why object to discussing it? Some of the commenters stressed the difference between crochet and knitting really strongly. Yeah, I know. They're different. But they're not that freaking different. Both are ways of creating fabric from yarn with a stick-like object by pulling loops through other loops. Methinks we have a case of folks taking themselves a leetle too seriously.
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jwaid97
Chatty Knitter

135 Posts

Posted - 11/21/2007 :  8:53:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit jwaid97's Homepage Send jwaid97 a Private Message
So does anyone really know why some knitters have such an anti-crochet attitude? I learned to crochet first and was ok with it but didn't just love it. After I learned to knit I decided to crochet again. I am much better at it now although I still prefer knitting. One of the best things about being able to do both is that if I see a pattern, then I know I can do it.

I buy magazines and books all the time when I don't just love all of the patterns. I have even gotten magazines when only a couple of the patterns appealed to me. Also, sometimes the articles are not what I want to read at a particular time but I have found that tastes change as well. One of the first knitting magazines I bought had a ton of lace stuff in it that I basically skipped because I was a new knitter and didn't think I could do lace work. After picking up lace this summer, I looked back at the magazine and it was like a brand new issue to me.


Joanna

Check out my first attempt at a website. It's still a WIP but I'm learning.
www.rxknitter.com
My blog is finally up. Check it out at www.rxknitter.com/blog
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Mocha
Permanent Resident

Singapore
2903 Posts

Posted - 11/22/2007 :  8:28:14 PM  Show Profile Send Mocha a Private Message
Wrong, it is not attitude against crochet, but like what Mokey pointed out, it's called Knitting Daily, not Knitting daily with crochet.

It's not paid newsletter, but then since they ask opinion if they could run crochet content- what would the reader think?

Well, I think they could run another newsletter called crochet daily and leave the mess out. I don't think that is hostility.
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of troy
Permanent Resident

USA
2474 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  09:40:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit of troy's Homepage Send of troy a Private Message
i crochet, too, but I HATE when i spend money on a KNITTING zine (or just TIME on a knitting zine, (or book or, BB, or..) and get crochet.

i don't remember EVER finding "bonus KNITTING PATTERNS" in crochet books or zines.. and i don't appreciate finding "BONUS" crochet patterns in my knitting zines--if i want to crochet, i can, (and i can buy books or zines or... for crochet.

KNITTERS ARE BOMBARDED with crochet patterns.

crocheters can buy and read crochet books from now till next year, and not find single 'bonus' knitting pattern. but knitters are constantly subjected to crochet patterns/directions/'bonuses' in what are labeled "KNITTING"--why is crochet being constantly "pushed" to knitters?

i understand why they get annoyed... i get annoyed too~

(it's like buying 'vegitarian times' and finding bonus patterns for meat dishes!) enough already!

Blog: http://golden-apples.blogspot.com/
Photogallery: http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v299/oftroy/
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Bethany
Permanent Resident

USA
1546 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  11:21:11 AM  Show Profile Send Bethany a Private Message
Er... if someone is spending money for the FREE Knitting Daily newsletter then they have more serious problems than seeing a crochet article now and then.

I'm not sure what magazines you've been reading but I'm amused that you say you never find knitting patterns in crochet books, given that if you trot over to the Crochetville forums, what you'll hear is tons of complaining about how people constantly put knitting patterns in crochet magazines and books. (For example, I think pretty much every issue of Interweave Crochet has included patterns that required knitting -- and sometimes quite a lot of knitting -- to make the pattern. The same is not true for Interweave Knitting and crochet. Sure, sometimes they have patterns that require using single crochet to finish an edge, but rarely is there the knitting equivalent of the "knit a garment and then put on a fancy crochet edge" patterns that pop up in Interweave Crochet.)

I don't think that crochet is being "pushed" on knitters, quite the opposite in fact. I don't recall ever hearing a knitter walking into a yarn store and being told that what they really need to do is stop knitting and learn to crochet, but I understand it's a common experience for crocheters to be told by LYS owners that what they really need to do is stop crocheting and learn to knit.

I think the issue is that there are SO many more outlets for knitting patterns than for crochet patters that the crochet patterns are sometimes thrown in with the knitting patterns because they have nowhere else to go. This is changing now but the gap has by no means been closed. Compare the number of good online knitting mags to good online crochet mags, for example. They're not putting a crochet article into Knitting Daily as part of a global conspiracy to make knitters learn to crochet, they're doing it because their IS no Crochet Daily and probably never will be. It's actually because of the second-class status of crochet that this sort of thing happens.

I think the objections we're seeing have EVERYTHING to do with seeing crochet as a inferior art form. I can't imagine that they would have gotten nearly as many complaints had they included an article on spinning or dyeing, despite the fact that it isn't Knitting and Spinning Daily or Knitting and Dyeing daily any more than it is Knitting and Crochet Daily. But knitters don't look down their noses on spinning and dyeing they way many do crochet.

And really, it's a little silly to complain it's not called Knitting and Crochet Daily so there shouldn't be any crochet content. It's Interweave's newsletter and surely they're the ones who get to decide what sort of content they put in it. If that includes content that promotes their crochet and spinning magazines to knitters then... well, that's not really that surprising, is it?

In fact, I suspect that even if there were a Crochet Daily (which as I said, there almost certainly never will be) there would be occasional articles about crochet in Knitting Daily. Telling crocheters about Interweave Crochet is preaching to the choir, after all, and that has limited utility. Naturally Interweave wants all knitters to learn to crochet, all crocheters to learn to knit, and BOTH knitters and crocheters to learn to spin. They sell more magazines that way.

I just think the whole thing is funny. No one objects to seeing the occasional article they're not interested in if it's knitting, but if it's crochet... then people go nuts. I mean, I never knit men's garments but I don't complain when I see patterns for them in magazines... I just don't buy the magazine if it doesn't have enough patterns I like. Why is the occasional feature on crochet/spinning/dyeing/how fuzzy angora rabbits are/etc any different?
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Valk_scot
Permanent Resident

United Kingdom
1281 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  11:53:35 AM  Show Profile Send Valk_scot a Private Message
Everyone seen this?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=JZcUjYpjKZs




http://spinningfishwife.blogspot.com/
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Atavistic
Permanent Resident

6604 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  4:48:45 PM  Show Profile  Visit Atavistic's Homepage Send Atavistic a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by of troy
KNITTERS ARE BOMBARDED with crochet patterns.



You and I have very different ideas about what the word "bombard" means.

Amanda Takes Off... and Amanda Knits

Hand and foot when harmonized forms martialism/but Military and literary when harmonized is art and this brings/philosophy. (Lee, Chang Hoo)
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fiberlicious
Permanent Resident

1637 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  8:56:46 PM  Show Profile Send fiberlicious a Private Message
I agree completely with Of Troy when it comes to knitting magazines I pay for. I have nothing against crochet, but when I buy a knitting magazine, I want KNITTING!

RE: Knitting Daily: 1. It's free. 2. It's clearly a marketing tool for Interweave, so my expectations are waaaaay reduced.
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Bethany
Permanent Resident

USA
1546 Posts

Posted - 11/24/2007 :  10:46:11 PM  Show Profile Send Bethany a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by fiberlicious

I agree completely with Of Troy when it comes to knitting magazines I pay for. I have nothing against crochet, but when I buy a knitting magazine, I want KNITTING!



That's also pretty much the objections of the people on Crochetville who were complaining about projects that incorporate both knitting and crochet appearing in Interweave.

I can understand their frustration but at the same time, combining knitting and crochet has a lot of possibility to produce cool stuff, and if those patterns are excluded from both knitting and crochet magazines, where are they going to be published? I don't see there being an "Interweave Knitting and Crochet" in the near future.
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Mocha
Permanent Resident

Singapore
2903 Posts

Posted - 11/25/2007 :  08:35:38 AM  Show Profile Send Mocha a Private Message
They asked for our opinions and they get it.

Beth, I agree that knitting & crochet combined can produce really nice stuffs.
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kdcrowley
Permanent Resident

USA
4773 Posts

Posted - 11/25/2007 :  10:44:08 AM  Show Profile  Visit kdcrowley's Homepage Send kdcrowley a Private Message
Yes, Mocha, but I think that the OP was pointing out that the opinions are phrased rather ahem vehemently, perhaps beyond appropriateness. I must say that I agree with that. Usually when folks are that adamant about something, it's because something else is behind it.

A woman I know that is in her early 40s, unmarried and no kids, who will spend an hour telling you why she does not want kids is a great example, in contrast to the ones same age that simply say, I don't want them. There is something else behind that, because she has the appearance not of not wanting kids, but of convincing herself that she does not.




Kelley
Check out my solar-dyed yarns at http://www.ceallachdyes.com Now offering FREE US shipping through year end.
and my blog at http://ceallachknits.blogspot.com
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